This Mat & Chat was hosted on on Instagram Live on Saturday, October 31st, 2020. The chat followed a 25 minute mat workout.
Victoria: First of all, I wanted to congratulate you again on your Pilates Style Magazine cover. Very exciting! Congratulations to you. I wanted to talk briefly about what that was like. We are going to talk more about what you spoke about in the article, because it relates to who you are, but talk to us about what it was like to shoot and film with Pilates Style!
Brooke: Well I met Bambi out at MomentumFest last year and we ended up having a conversation there. I was telling her about my story, we were just at the booth hanging gout after a class, talking with her, talking with Jessica, and telling her about all of the work I was doing with the WNBA players and helping them get ready for the Olympics. She was like: “Wait a minute- you’re helping the USA Olympic basketball team?” And I was like: “Yes-these are some of the best female athletes! They’re amazing!” And I had also been working with the Seattle Storm. They won the championship in 2018, they just won this year, 2020- they’re the WNBA champs again. So we were just having conversations about that. I was telling her the root of that and then even my work with local high schoolers and different stories. So she was like: “There are some stories to tell- let’s do this! Let’s do this next year at MomentumFest!” But here we are, where MomentumFest is online, and then they emailed me out of the blue and said: “Hey! Do you want to be on the cover and write an article on whatever you want?” And I was like: “Uh yes! Sure.” I’m pleased with how it worked out because then I really had total freedom. I did a photoshoot with a local photographer in Asheville, we just messed around.
Victoria: Oh, cool!
Brooke: Yeah, so I was able to get photos that I want for my own website and branding, and then-
Victoria: That’s amazing! So you didn’t even have to travel anywhere!
Brooke: Yeah! And I had total freedom to write the article. They were great- they did hardly any editing. I wrote my sort of intro story about how I weave it all together, and then I wanted to feature exercises, as I told you, through the 5 elements- incorporating mat moves and chair moves that align energetically with water, with fire, wood, earth, metal.
I love the wunda chair. I’ve had this Gratz- it’s my favorite old chair, I’ve had it since before I even had a studio. It’s like hard on top, pad’s gone, client’s complain! They’re like: “Will you ever get that re-covered?” And I’m like: “No, no, no- that’s my chair.”
Victoria: “I like the feedback!”
Brooke: Yes, I do! So it was a really fun photoshoot. I had been messing around. I like to play. I am very much a classical instructor, but I like to play in life and see where my Pilates can take me. Like, on the monkey bars with my kids, upside down in a handstand. And then I had been playing around with ways to use my core and float. And “Chisel” is a class I created that has a lot of planks, and you slide- it’s easy and fun. It’s like you’re on the reformer but there’s no reformer. So I like to find a way to find power and ease-
Victoria: This is a good time to be “on the reformer but not on the reformer”- with Covid, and all of the virtual.
Brooke: Yes, so I like to keep playing. So that cover shoot, that cover picture of being upside down on the chair was just sort of spontaneous. I’m there with the guy, and I was like: “Hey! I think I can hold this for a while- are you ready?” And so we had to keep going a few times. I was up there like: “I’m ready! But I think my face is getting really red.”
Victoria: That’s the hardest part. When I did my filming with Alo Moves, the filming the workout wasn’t so bad- I mean, whatever. But the photoshoots after? These people- bless their hearts- but they don’t know anything about Pilates- they’ll be like: “You know that thing you did, where you were upside down, or your legs were overhead-“
Brooke: “Can you do it again?”
Victoria: Yes. And then it’s been two minutes and I’m like: “You don’t understand!” I got more of a workout during the photoshoot than I did in the actual workout. It is so hard to hold these positions. But nothing that I did in Alo was anything like hovering over a chair, with my legs suspended behind me. So you are definitely a superstar.
Brooke: *laughs* It was pretty fun!
Victoria: For those who haven’t read your Pilates Style spread, you just mentioned working with the WNBA, but your athletic background is basketball- it was your love, you played through college-
Brooke: Yeah, so I grew up in Idaho, it was a ski town, where we were just outside all the time. I went to a high school where we did backpacking trips, backcountry skiing, rock climbing- so I was very physical always. I played soccer, tennis, and basketball. I was fortunate to be able to play basketball in college, division 3. I loved it, I worked my tail off. I have always loved being a part of a team, and having a coach and being pushed and being team captain and learning.
Victoria: Go girl!
Brooke: Then after college, I coached! I coached middle school, and I coached varsity girls, while I was being a Pilates teacher on the side. It was when I opened Clasique in 2009 in Asheville that I had to stop coaching high school. I missed it! When I launched CoreSelf, I wanted people to be able to do their mat practice at home. That’s when the WNBA thing just kind of showed up. A trainer called- and I still work with her very closely- but she said “I’m an elite sports performance coach, and all of my athletes are doing your free YouTube videos. Do you want to take this relationship further? They’ve been doing your same videos for the last two years.” And I was like: “Uh, yes.” So now I make them custom websites, and make them workouts that they need. I’ve helped quite a few of them recover through big Achilles surgeries, or things that are going on. Now we’re getting ready for their season, and hopefully we have some kind of Olympics. So it’s been special. I think my athletic background combined with my Chinese medicine- my voice is kind of unique. It is classical and clear, but it’s also creative and fun, and sporty! It’s sporty. I can’t help it- I’m sporty.
Victoria: Yes. So you mentioned in the beginning- if people tuned in late, you gave us a quick little studio tour. Clasique is classical Pilates, it’s acupuncture, and it’s massage therapy. So you are also an acupuncturist. You went to school for acupuncture and that Dao-is mindset, that frame of mind, kind of transfers with you- and if you read the Pilates Style Mag article, you talk about the five elements. You kind of integrate science, acupuncture- well, acupuncture is science- but how would you describe all of the things you bring together into your Pilates teaching? You have this athletic background, so you know from that background how to teach athletes, and then you went to a 4-year school for anatomy, musculature, meridians, and then you have classical Pilates. So you have a lot going on. Talk to us about how they all come together and how that makes you a better Pilates person.
Brooke: Yeah so, somehow as a teenager I started going to get acupuncture from a local acupuncturist from Ketchum, Idaho, where I grew up. I think I sprained an ankle, or something happened, and I was like- I don’t want to use ice, I don’t want to take Ibuprofen, help me! And I developed a relationship with this woman, and she’s still a mentor and a friend. Every time I go home to see my parents, I schedule a treatment with her. So she’s been helping me since I was 14, and I’m 41 now. I learned at a really young age that Chinese medicine was a way that I could help my body figure things out. I kept through that through high school, college, even through emotional stuff.
I started training to do Pilates at 22, my mom took me to a class with her, and then I went to Seattle at 23 and lived there and just trained with Dorothea [fefe] super intensely for 7 months. Then I took it into the world. I really only did that initial super-solid training with her, and she’s incredible, so it was very comprehensive. Then I just started living it and training teachers, and then incorporating both. I was teaching Pilates while going to the 4-year acupuncture program here. I was already teaching Pilates so I was used to touching people. It was kind of fun, because my trainings have enhanced each other. In acupuncture school, when it came time for people to feel- where are the acupuncture points and the meridians- sometimes people aren’t used to touching, but I was already teaching Pilates and I saw the body as a whole already- you know, how do things move, how are they communicating, how are things blocked? I already had a sense of that and knew how to connect, so that helped me learn acupuncture. And then yes, of course, we’re learning the details of muscle and anatomy. We learn a lot of Western medicine so that as Chinese medicine practitioners, we can communicate with Western practitioners, and then have a relationship. I have a relationship with the Director of Sports Medicine in Asheville, at the hospital. He refers clients to me and to Clasique- so there’s really a shared language. We certainly learned so much about the body, about anatomy. Chinese medicine is so rich, it’s so cool.
The philosophy- I have plenty of moments where I go: I think Joe Pilates was very Dao. He understood that it’s how we’re going to navigate our lives; how we’re going to craft our lives. How do we come back to our center- how do we breathe? How do we keep ourselves move chi-keep- move chi and keep ourselves nourished at the same time. Because if we move too much, we’re not nourishing- we’re depleting! So, the philosophies for me really interweave. Clasique is this amazing place now where I have an amazing, talented team of practitioners. I have 4 Pilates instructors, 2 apprentices. I just hired two more acupuncturists and another over there, so it’s a crew. And so far it’s all women! Martin asked if I’d hire men, and I was like: “Of course I would!” It’s just a group of super intelligent, talented, compassionate women right now who work here and serve our community, and let me then remove myself from it. Even though I’m the creator, it’s been about eleven and a half years- I get to keep evolving with CoreSelf and with my mentoring of other instructors.
Victoria: You have a lot of fans out there. Michelle just commented that she’s falling in love with you right now. So I wanted to ask- we spoke about this on the phone, and I don’t’ want to spend too much time on this. It’s been a crazy month in the Pilates world- there’s been a lot of tumult and turmoil on the Internet. It is what it is. One of the discussions I think when it comes to classical Pilates instructors- it’s an age-old discussion, and it seems it’s been brought up again in the last couple weeks, months, whatever- is there might be something about anatomy that makes classical Pilates not as valid, or not as scientifically sound. There seems to be this discussion, like: “Joseph Pilates created this, but since then we’ve learned so much more! So this is why we do this, this, and this, and have veered from a classical path.” But as somebody who comes from such an anatomical background, and you have all of this other knowledge you bring with you into the system- you’re still choosing to keep it classically based. So-
Brooke: Yeah- I think I made this on one of my personal Instagram as I was talking about parenting. I have two kids- they’re 9 and 6- and I both try to give them a lot of freedom, and then I’m also a total hardass. I feel like that also shows up here. We are a classical studio- we don’t have the Bosu balls- it’s simple, it’s clear. It’s not that I don’t agree, I’ll go play around on stuff. I think that in the world- there’s a lot of chaos and noise. There is so much value in clarity and simplicity. I just want to keep this clear and simple. We can be creative within that system- there is so much freedom inside clarity- and I love that about the classical method. So, yeah, I know a lot of this going on, and I’ve thought a lot about it, and I write a lot about it. I’ve not made any big public statements- that doesn’t mean I’m not looking at it or seeing it. Definitely there are comments about white, thin, magazine-cover bodies, and I’m like: “Well, I am all of those things. I was just on a cover of a magazine.” And I am white, although I’ve never had that experience; I have had an experience of a mixed person. We could spend hours talking about that, because of my look, I’m constantly questioned; “What are you?” Because I very much come across as mixed in life. My very first memories are: “What are you? Are you mixed?” And it’s been very complicated and I am unpeeling that right now. Because I’m like: “Oh, this is racism. This is racism that I have actually felt” but I have so much white privilege.
Victoria: Yeah, wow, so you have it from both sides. That’s very interesting.
Brooke: It’s very interesting. So I’m just looking at it, and listening. I know that classical Pilates has stuff going on- I know that. Sometimes I just get in my lane, and I’m like: “I’m just going to do what I do as well as I can.”
Victoria: That should be everybody’s goal.
Brooke: I know by now that I cannot please everybody, I cannot meet everybody. Some people are just not going o like me and that’s okay. It’s just like in relationships and friendships. You can’t have one friend that is just going to be all of the things. I learned that too- I got divorced a few years ago. You can’t have one partner who is all the things. But I was surprised, actually at the same MomentumFest, it happens a lot actually, but I was just sitting after a class eating lunch, and people will come up and be like: “Who are you? What do you do?” I work out a lot, and I work out so that I feel Pilates inside of me. I think that’s what people see. I don’t do anything perfectly, but I try to live it, I feel it. I think that shows up when they see me in a class, and they’ll come ask questions. They were like: “Wait, you’re classical? But you’re not rigid!’
Victoria: I can’t!
Brooke: And I’m like: “This was my training!” and they’ll go: “But you’re like, fun!” And I’m like: “Yes!” I’m just me, and this is my training, and I love my training.
Victoria: For what it’s worth, there are just so many approaches. Everyone comes to Pilates from different backgrounds, everybody. So to have this assumption that everyone who is teaching a certain type of Pilates is this way or that way is very ignorant- for lack of better word. So that’s very interesting to me.
Brooke: Right, and I’m always learning. As a classical teacher, I’m always learning from other people all the time. I’m so grateful- I think back to this year, and I was intending to travel. I was going to go to Seattle, I work with a player on the Sparks, and I was going to go watch her play, I couldn’t wait to watch her play. So none of that happened, but on a whim, I went out and saw Saul at Winsor Choza- he’s become a good friend. I just like to go and work out with him. We hang out and work out, hang out, and work out.
Victoria: Yeah, he’s awesome.
Brooke: So I got some early trip in before everything got shut down in January. I got beach time, workout time, and learning form another Pilates instructor that just loves it and does it too.
Victoria: That was really the whole idea behind Mat & Chat- we’re learning from one another here. And when I created it in March or April- that was the height of lockdown in NYC at least. People weren’t leaving and you couldn’t see your friends because you had to stay apart, and so the idea was: “Okay, we’re all sitting at home and we have nothing to do, so let’s make the best of this, let’s learn from one another, let’s workout- because we’re all sitting on our butts all day, and let’s get deeper into who these people are, aside from just what they teach.” You know, you have people who come to the studio- and at this point, most of my clients are close friends- they know my whole life. One of them named all of my ex-boyfriends the other day and I was like: “Wow! We really do cover all of these topics.” But I do think it’s very important to take things away. Every Mat & Chat that I host, for the week after, there is a piece of that instructor that I take forward into my teaching. What I take from this and bring to my clients this week? I don’t know yet. But there is always room to learn and to take it further. I think it’s so important that you make that a part of your regular routine.
Brooke: I feel that it’s not always that I can get out and do those things- I learn constantly from my own teachers in here and my apprentices- and my clients. I’m like: “Oh!” That happens with a client. You want to see this action happen in the body and it’s not happening here, so we have to go over to this apparatus and let’s see if we can find it over here. So I feel like I’m always learning from my clients. I’m learning so much from teaching privates online. I’m surprised.
Victoria: Oh yeah. I’m seeing this whole body in this frame, and I’m like: “Oooh! I can look at your toe and your head at the same time? It’s pretty cool.”
Brooke: Yeah, and I’ve had to deepen my skills and get even better with my words. And actually, through this time I have spent remarkably more time with my two apprentices. Somehow, we had to keep their training going! When I train apprentices, it’s 20 months- this intense mentoring.
Victoria: Whoa!
Brooke: Oh yeah girl, 20 months. It’s the real deal. I would love to train people faster, I cannot. Because I want to train excellent, remarkable instructors who understand on this deep, rich level. They know how to touch, they know how to use their words, they know how to troubleshoot, how to connect. It’s all mind, body, spirit- it’s all woven in there, so it gives them some tools in that way. It’s very rich and transformative, and I’ve spent a lot of time with them to keep them going, because they were ready to take a teaching test, and then it was like: “Oh crap, now what do we do?” So we get in to the work, we get in to our workouts, and it’s cool. They have transformed- they will tell you, it’s really a remarkable journey- it’s an evolution. We’ve been able to keep that going and I’m learning so much from their learning process. I’m a giver, a giver of information; I want to share everything possible I know. IT lands when people are ready. IT’s the same- when they’re ready to learn that part- and maybe I’ve said the same thing 20 times- but when it’s the right moment, it’s going to happen.
Brooke’s Speed Round
City or beach
Sweet or savory?
Cat or dog?
Adventure or comfort?
Books or movies?
Nights in or nights out?
Summer or winter?
Tea or coffee?
Early bird or night owl? Midday!
Pizza or pasta?
Europe or Asia? Would like to go to Asia!
Spring or fall?
Breakfast or dinner?